NewsGang and Gillmor Gang IRC Transcripts for 09/05/2008

Gillmor Gang 09.05.08

NewsGang Live 09.05.08

Session Start: Fri Sep 05 00:00:04 2008
Session Ident: #newsgang-live
2008/09/05 [00:00] <+WebPixie> we
2008/09/05 [00:00] <+WebPixie> we're here
2008/09/05 [00:03] <+BruceLerner> thx karoli. I'm working on it. wasn't really prep'd.
2008/09/05 [00:04] <+exador23> the wcco video pretty damning. protester herded to bridge then arrested including videographer.
2008/09/05 [00:13] <+exador23> "Once a government is committed to the principle of silencing the voice of opposition, it has only one way to go, and that is down the path of increasingly repressive measures, until it becomes a source of terror to all its citizens and creates a country where everyone lives in fear." Harry Truman
Session Close: Fri Sep 05 00:22:03 2008

Session Start: Fri Sep 05 00:19:34 2008
Session Ident: #newsgang-live
022008/09/05 [00:19] * Disconnected

Session Start: Fri Sep 05 00:22:03 2008
Session Ident: #newsgang-live
022008/09/05 [00:22] * Disconnected
022008/09/05 [09:35] * Attempting to rejoin channel #newsgang-live
032008/09/05 [09:35] * Rejoined channel #newsgang-live
032008/09/05 [09:35] * Topic is 'NewsGang Live after McCain speech this evening'
032008/09/05 [09:35] * Set by theagent on Thu Sep 04 16:15:27
2008/09/05 [13:56] <+marccanter> I ain't got no PIN
2008/09/05 [14:00] <@stevegillmor> stream coming up now
2008/09/05 [14:08] <@theagent> what are we talking about? Chrome?
2008/09/05 [14:09] <@theagent> never mind.. answered it
2008/09/05 [14:20] <+hardaway> My audio stream comes and goes. I guess I will listen to the recording
2008/09/05 [14:20] <+kshep> What's the webkit/chrome equivalent of XUL?
2008/09/05 [14:21] <+kshep> Can the XUL-based Mozilla plugins like FTP, IRC, EC2 admin be ported over to Chrome in any sort of direct way?
2008/09/05 [14:21] <+kshep> FireFTP, ChatZilla, etc.
2008/09/05 [14:29] <+kshep> Just rewrite it all in AJAX?
2008/09/05 [14:29] <+kshep> Any plans for XUL support?
2008/09/05 [14:33] <+kshep> people *are* demanding :-)
2008/09/05 [14:34] <+kshep> just let us install .xpis
2008/09/05 [15:58] <+jromeh> hearing you here
2008/09/05 [15:59] <+jromeh> on a working birthday
2008/09/05 [15:59] <+jromeh> how was the show last night, missed it, not yet there
2008/09/05 [16:02] <+jromeh> how many were "train-wrecking"
2008/09/05 [16:05] <+jromeh> focus on McCain negatives, there are plenty
2008/09/05 [16:07] <+hardaway> Here's the link to my investigative reporter piece on Palin: http://www.gooznews.com/archives/001170.htmlhttp://www.gooznews.com/archives/001170.html
2008/09/05 [16:07] <+iPlant> thanks francine
2008/09/05 [16:07] <+jromeh> they're calling all of us stupid, on both sides
032008/09/05 [16:11] * ustreamer-32149 is now known as ukdme
2008/09/05 [16:12] <+kshep> same thing was true four years ago
2008/09/05 [16:13] <+iPlant> we feel you're too proud of yourself
2008/09/05 [16:13] <+hardaway> http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfgate/detail?blogid=14&entry_id=29929 Numbers of people who watched Obama v McCain
2008/09/05 [16:13] <+exador23> obama called for the world to step up in berlin
2008/09/05 [16:14] <+kshep> that's just the folks on the call, francine ;-)
2008/09/05 [16:14] <+iPlant> there's just a lot of nationalism in america
2008/09/05 [16:14] <+iPlant> it's so accepted, seen as a great thing
2008/09/05 [16:14] <+kshep> we call it patriotism, iPlant
2008/09/05 [16:17] <+exador23> "They first use flags to shrink-wrap peoples' minds and smother real thought, and then as ceremonial shrouds to bury the willing dead."
2008/09/05 [16:18] <+jromeh> when it comes to what we do wrong, many are jingoists aligned with government
2008/09/05 [16:18] <+michaelpinto> a sense of humility is american (ex. jimmy stuart) arrogance doesn't become us
2008/09/05 [16:19] <+jromeh> often threats are made to sucker those threatened into doing something foolish
2008/09/05 [16:19] <+michaelpinto> amy goodman arrested
2008/09/05 [16:20] <+michaelpinto> this happened in nyc 4 years ago all of those arrests will be dismissed and the city will be sued - but it will take years to clean up
2008/09/05 [16:20] <+michaelpinto> there was video of the amy goodman arrest - she was clearly a reporter
2008/09/05 [16:20] <+exador23> here's the article karoli referred to http://ur1.ca/4uc
2008/09/05 [16:20] <+exador23> that comes next
2008/09/05 [16:21] <+jromeh> and attacked by swat teams
2008/09/05 [16:21] <+michaelpinto> actually they kick their doors in - the organizing group
2008/09/05 [16:21] <+michaelpinto> indymedia covered it
2008/09/05 [16:21] <+exador23> they did gestapo a journalist house
2008/09/05 [16:22] <+jromeh> at riflepoint, while handcuffed, we'll tear your place down, then show a vague warrant afterward, and say you had it coming!
2008/09/05 [16:22] <+kr8tr> exador - where is a link to a reputable source that reports that?
2008/09/05 [16:22] <+exador23> yes. give me a moment days ago.
2008/09/05 [16:22] <+michaelpinto> i watched this in nyc 4 years ago - they were sweeping people
2008/09/05 [16:24] <+ukidNme> so what's the issue?
2008/09/05 [16:25] <+michaelpinto> q. is this the real issue? we seem to be distracting ourselves
2008/09/05 [16:25] <+ukidNme> oh my
2008/09/05 [16:25] <+ukidNme> u try controlling a riot
2008/09/05 [16:26] <+jromeh> not at all proud having tax dollars spent on such thuggery
2008/09/05 [16:26] <+ukidNme> assumption of thuggery
2008/09/05 [16:26] <+exador23> we're not talking about inside the RNC
2008/09/05 [16:26] <+ukidNme> u have no idea
2008/09/05 [16:26] <+michaelpinto> inside vs. outside conention is different
2008/09/05 [16:27] <+michaelpinto> folks were getting distracted
2008/09/05 [16:27] <+jromeh> observed thuggery
2008/09/05 [16:27] <+michaelpinto> rob i think you're thinking of of a soccar match
2008/09/05 [16:27] <+exador23> before http://ur1.ca/4m1 after http://is.gd/2ctv
2008/09/05 [16:27] <+ukidNme> why don't you all go do a sit-in
2008/09/05 [16:27] <+ukidNme> is this the 60s
2008/09/05 [16:27] <+ukidNme> sheesh
2008/09/05 [16:27] <+jromeh> no this is america
2008/09/05 [16:28] <+ukidNme> duh
2008/09/05 [16:28] <+exador23> those are the 17yo kid pics http://is.gd/2ctv
2008/09/05 [16:28] <+ukidNme> thanks
2008/09/05 [16:28] <+kshep> http://www.minnesotaindependent.com/6952/youth-in-iconic-rnc-protest-photo-beaten-by-police-according-to-his-mother
2008/09/05 [16:28] <+ukidNme> didn't know that
2008/09/05 [16:28] <+jromeh> and you're without a name, figures
2008/09/05 [16:28] <+ukidNme> figures?
2008/09/05 [16:28] <+ukidNme> what's an exador23?
2008/09/05 [16:29] <+michaelpinto> folks we seems to be getting distracted by the larger issues
2008/09/05 [16:29] <+jromeh> an established identity known around here
2008/09/05 [16:29] <+jromeh> like the canadian plants recently
2008/09/05 [16:29] <+ukidNme> yeah, live in the past
2008/09/05 [16:30] <+kshep> let's all talk at the same time
2008/09/05 [16:30] <+ukidNme> you say mccain's too old
2008/09/05 [16:30] <+kshep> Here's Keith Smith protesting http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvVK1XbtGgA
2008/09/05 [16:31] <+exador23> Here's one article on the gestapo-styled raids http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/08/30/police_raids/index.html
2008/09/05 [16:31] <+ukidNme> what about protests at abortion clinics - lemme guess you're not too worried about them
2008/09/05 [16:31] <+ukidNme> the venu is the issue here
2008/09/05 [16:31] <+michaelpinto> people who go to abortion clinics aren't public officials
2008/09/05 [16:33] <+exador23> There is evidence of FBI & secret service involvement in paying people to infiltrate vegan potlucks
2008/09/05 [16:33] <+michaelpinto> i frankly feel that the protesters aren't helping getting obama elected - so they don't get too much sympathy from me'
2008/09/05 [16:33] <+kshep> That's because Anarchists are Democrats
2008/09/05 [16:33] <+ukidNme> haha
2008/09/05 [16:34] <+michaelpinto> folks we're being distracted by the fringe
2008/09/05 [16:34] <+exador23> the cops at DNC let people have their say.
2008/09/05 [16:34] <+kshep> what's your point, michael?
2008/09/05 [16:34] <+kshep> :-)
2008/09/05 [16:35] <+exador23> you guys defending the police really need to be informed
2008/09/05 [16:35] <+michaelpinto> my point is that the protesters would be better spending their time doing something REAL like voter reg., making phone calls or donating money
2008/09/05 [16:35] <+kshep> not everybody
2008/09/05 [16:35] <+michaelpinto> the republicans want you NOT to focus on the real issues like health insurance, etc.
2008/09/05 [16:36] <+exador23> the point of the protest was to let people know the war is real.
2008/09/05 [16:36] <+kshep> sorta missed the point then
2008/09/05 [16:36] <+jromeh> the protest is ok in america no matter what their point is
2008/09/05 [16:36] <+michaelpinto> the protest makes the war into a cartoon
2008/09/05 [16:36] <+exador23> this war is very different than others - shop as usual
2008/09/05 [16:36] <+ukidNme> really exador23,next thing you'll say is that we landed on the moon
2008/09/05 [16:37] <+michaelpinto> if you want to stop the war get your officials elected into office
2008/09/05 [16:38] <+michaelpinto> http://twitter.com/maddow
2008/09/05 [16:38] <+michaelpinto> maddow does her reseach - but she'll being preaching to the chior
2008/09/05 [16:38] <+michaelpinto> we need to reach out to indie voters and republicans
2008/09/05 [16:39] <+michaelpinto> but rob america is just getting started!
2008/09/05 [16:39] <+michaelpinto> most americans are just learning about the election
2008/09/05 [16:39] <+ukidNme> and it's dead-even
2008/09/05 [16:40] <+kshep> Is the Daily Show "pure hate"
2008/09/05 [16:40] <+ukidNme> pure funny
2008/09/05 [16:40] <+michaelpinto> the danger is us getting burned out and apathetic and BITTER
2008/09/05 [16:40] <+kshep> satire, political commentary... pure hate?
2008/09/05 [16:40] <+exador23> I'm serious. read about the "anarchists" now charged with terrorism http://ur1.ca/4n0
2008/09/05 [16:41] <+ukidNme> cops are always assumed guilty by some
2008/09/05 [16:41] <+exador23> The protester stuff is nothing compared to the preemptive raids.
2008/09/05 [16:42] <+ukidNme> the intention is to "get out of hand"
2008/09/05 [16:42] <+ukidNme> they get more press that way
2008/09/05 [16:42] <+ukidNme> look how much time is being spent here on a few
2008/09/05 [16:42] <+michaelpinto> you know guys - the ron paul folks held their own convention in Minn - they were organized - got media attention (NYTimes) yet they didn't have to march in the streets
2008/09/05 [16:43] <+exador23> I was too Francine. agreed.
2008/09/05 [16:43] <+kshep> you never want to be dismissed as a stereotype
2008/09/05 [16:44] <+exador23> show me that link please.
2008/09/05 [16:44] <+michaelpinto> they should join the NRA and upgrade their hardware at some gun shows
2008/09/05 [16:44] <+michaelpinto> folks we only have 60 days or so and time is wasting away
2008/09/05 [16:44] <+exador23> conspiracy to riot in the furtherance of terrorism
2008/09/05 [16:45] <+kshep> Jon Stewart last night... McCain talking about his POW experience...Gitmo isn't a prison, it's a leadership accademy
2008/09/05 [16:45] <+michaelpinto> if the protesters were serious they'd be ringing doorbells in swing states
2008/09/05 [16:45] <+kshep> sort of a generic mauve
2008/09/05 [16:46] <+jromeh> so why are the would be assassins in CO being handled leniently?
2008/09/05 [16:46] <+jromeh> got anything like that in your house rob?
2008/09/05 [16:46] <+kshep> that's, like, half the state, isn't it Rob?
2008/09/05 [16:46] <+jromeh> bet you do
2008/09/05 [16:46] <+exador23> so what about the people plotting to assassinate Obama?
2008/09/05 [16:46] <@theagent> if they would have killed one person with a Molotov cocktail... you'd all be screaming bloody murder
2008/09/05 [16:47] <+michaelpinto> the conspiracy is to distract us from getting obama elected
2008/09/05 [16:47] <+exador23> Amy was not maced.
2008/09/05 [16:47] <+michaelpinto> amy wasn't maced
2008/09/05 [16:48] <+michaelpinto> amy was stepping in to save er two producers - who were media
2008/09/05 [16:48] <+kr8tr> media has no immunity to the law
2008/09/05 [16:49] <+michaelpinto> can we not let the protests distract us from getting obama into office?
2008/09/05 [16:49] <+kshep> everybody walks into all these situations with a set of expectations
2008/09/05 [16:49] <@TinaGillmor> Francine is either too loud or to "distant" sounding
2008/09/05 [16:49] <+kshep> those expectations certailnly color not only what happens, but how they perceive what happens
2008/09/05 [16:50] <+ukidNme> did you hear the speech last night?
2008/09/05 [16:50] <+kshep> if you walk into a situation expecting the fascist cops to arrest you
2008/09/05 [16:50] <+kshep> guess what
2008/09/05 [16:50] <+ukidNme> fear, really?
2008/09/05 [16:50] <+kshep> if you walk into the situation expecting anarchist protesters to riot
2008/09/05 [16:50] <+kshep> guess what
2008/09/05 [16:50] <+exador23> this made the news http://ur1.ca/4if the preemptive raids did not
2008/09/05 [16:50] <+ukidNme> how about experience vs hope/dreams/blah
2008/09/05 [16:51] <+jromeh> but its great to ignore what we do to <censored> off others!
2008/09/05 [16:51] <+jromeh> it's
2008/09/05 [16:51] <+ukidNme> what is that exactly?
2008/09/05 [16:52] <+ukidNme> hope is never a plan in business
2008/09/05 [16:52] <+michaelpinto> but we're not on the offensive - thatw ould mean putting in all of the troops into afghanistan
2008/09/05 [16:52] <+exador23> http://www.tcdailyplanet.net/node/13952 video of journalists house raid.
2008/09/05 [16:52] <+iPlant> rob you seriously think the last decade of american offensive has made you safer?
2008/09/05 [16:53] <+kshep> well, iPlant, right after the WTC attack, many were expecting that the US would be dealing with day-in, day-out street level terrorism
2008/09/05 [16:53] <+kr8tr> iPlant - Yes. Prove I am wrong.
2008/09/05 [16:54] <+michaelpinto> but rob you live in texas - the terorists were never going to attack you, so you're not on the front like me in nyc
2008/09/05 [16:54] <+iPlant> it can't be proved either way
2008/09/05 [16:54] <+kshep> ala day-to-day Israeli/Palestinian conflict, Beirut, etc. All the stuff American's think of when they used to hear terrorism
2008/09/05 [16:54] <+aronski> fight fight fight vs work work work...
2008/09/05 [16:54] <+michaelpinto> see as a new yorker that pissed me off
2008/09/05 [16:54] <+kshep> the fact that we haven't seen any of that certainly indicates we're safer than we could have been in some alternate timeline
2008/09/05 [16:54] <+aronski> message was fight fight fight fight, not unite
2008/09/05 [16:55] <+michaelpinto> i smelled it
2008/09/05 [16:55] <+kshep> whether we'd really have seen that day-to-day street level bombing etc
2008/09/05 [16:55] <+aronski> disaster porn
2008/09/05 [16:55] <+kshep> well, there's no way to prove that
2008/09/05 [16:55] <+exador23> here's journalist Salazar of DN filming her arrest - chilling http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-d9wmqO2Khw
2008/09/05 [16:55] <+jromeh> stickers and magnets on your vehicles are easy!
2008/09/05 [16:56] <+kshep> exador23: that's chilling because you want it to be. or should I say you expect it to be
2008/09/05 [16:56] <+ukidNme> "hope, change" where's the meat?
2008/09/05 [16:56] <+ukidNme> fairy tales
2008/09/05 [16:57] <+exador23> "where do I go" "Press!Press!" what's not to be concerned with? She had RNC floor press credentials
2008/09/05 [16:58] <+exador23> kshep my #1 issue is the constitution. the economy, even war can be debated & open to compromise
2008/09/05 [16:59] <@TinaGillmor> bye and thanks folks
2008/09/05 [16:59] <+Karoli> okay folks, thanks for the participation and the links.
2008/09/05 [16:59] <+Karoli> good show :)
2008/09/05 [16:59] <+kr8tr> :) fun one
2008/09/05 [17:00] <+kshep> glad we got all that straightened out
2008/09/05 [17:00] <+kr8tr> thks, Jerry
2008/09/05 [17:00] <@theagent> no worries..
2008/09/05 [17:00] <@TinaGillmor> thanks Jerry
2008/09/05 [17:00] <@theagent> no worries..
2008/09/05 [17:01] <@theagent> things should calm down for me in the next week
2008/09/05 [17:01] <@theagent> we have an early alpha release up
2008/09/05 [17:01] <@theagent> thank god
2008/09/05 [17:01] <@theagent> http://alpha.perssonas.com:8080
2008/09/05 [17:02] <+kshep> You just saved my address
2008/09/05 [17:02] <@theagent> cool
2008/09/05 [17:02] <+kshep> please let me know when you have room for more ;-)
2008/09/05 [17:02] <@theagent> soon very soon
2008/09/05 [17:03] <+kshep> and lemme know when you want to start pushing data to the track stream
2008/09/05 [17:03] <+kshep> :-)
2008/09/05 [17:03] <@theagent> sure thing!
2008/09/05 [17:05] <+kshep> doesnt have to be XMPP. You can just post Atom via HTTP api
2008/09/05 [17:06] <@theagent> we have openfire running
2008/09/05 [17:06] <@theagent> but we can go both ways
2008/09/05 [17:06] <+kshep> well, if you want to mess with it. it's up to you
2008/09/05 [17:06] <@theagent> adding getting ready to fire up laconi.ca support over the weekend
2008/09/05 [17:06] <+kshep> army.twit.tv is coming in over HTTP
Session Close: Sat Sep 06 00:00:02 2008