NewsGang and Gillmor Gang IRC Transcripts for 08/15/2008

Gillmor Gang 08.15.08

NewsGang 08.15.08

Session Start: Fri Aug 15 00:00:03 2008
Session Ident: #newsgang-live
032008/08/15 [13:34] * theagent changes topic to 'Friday Gillmor Gang starts at 10:45 PDT'
2008/08/15 [13:52] <+marccanter> howdy I'm here
2008/08/15 [13:54] <@theagent> thanks for jumping into the chat, Marc
2008/08/15 [13:54] <@theagent> everyone start tweeting the links
2008/08/15 [13:54] <+marccanter> what links?
2008/08/15 [13:54] <@theagent> Marc Canter live now on Gillmor Gang: http://ustream.tv/channel/newsgang-live
2008/08/15 [13:55] <+marccanter> hi David
2008/08/15 [13:55] <+kshep> :-)
2008/08/15 [13:56] <@theagent> he was at his limits without track ;-)
2008/08/15 [13:57] <@theagent> I miss the jam sessions we used to do at the MacUser parties in the late 80's
2008/08/15 [13:58] <+kshep> Sanborn was on NPR back on 8/2
2008/08/15 [13:58] <+kshep> http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=93198714
2008/08/15 [13:58] <+kevinmarks> morning all
2008/08/15 [13:58] <@theagent> hey Kev
2008/08/15 [13:58] <+marccanter> hey dude
2008/08/15 [13:58] <+kevinmarks> nice to see you in LA the other day, theagent
2008/08/15 [13:59] <@TinaGillmor> you can get to that npr link from davidsanborn.com
2008/08/15 [13:59] <@theagent> kevinmarks, wished we could have spent more time chatting... I need to come up and hang for a couple days. Catch up with everyone
2008/08/15 [13:59] <@theagent> I need to go see Marc's fence ;-)
2008/08/15 [13:59] <@theagent> and leave my mark ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+kshep> you can't play the torrent til you get the whole thing
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+kshep> seeds
2008/08/15 [14:00] <@theagent> how many seeders vs. leechers
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+kshep> track
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+kshep> ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+kevinmarks> well, you could play it if you know you have enough of the beginning
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+kevinmarks> is netflix on demand?
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+kshep> yes
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+kshep> well, the streaming stuff
2008/08/15 [14:00] <+marccanter> so I see a bit of iyt - and then wait for teh rest?
2008/08/15 [14:01] <+kshep> can't really do that with bittorrent, because yo udon't know what order the chunks will come down in
2008/08/15 [14:01] <@theagent> SDOCG is a great show
2008/08/15 [14:01] <+marccanter> yes
2008/08/15 [14:01] <+kshep> hulu.com
2008/08/15 [14:01] <+marccanter> netflix is ON-DEMAND absoutely
2008/08/15 [14:02] <+kshep> 'cept this week. Netflix isn't on demand this week :-)
2008/08/15 [14:02] <+kshep> how much does scoble cost them every time he posts, with his 30K followers?
2008/08/15 [14:02] <@TinaGillmor> hi Kevin
2008/08/15 [14:03] <+kevinmarks> hi tina
2008/08/15 [14:03] <@theagent> what bridge are we talking about here?
2008/08/15 [14:03] <+kevinmarks> nice to see you
2008/08/15 [14:04] <+marccanter> (virtually)
2008/08/15 [14:04] <+kevinmarks> identi.ca to twitter bridge
2008/08/15 [14:04] <+scottag> I unsub'ed from Steve because of that identi.ca bridge.
2008/08/15 [14:04] <+kshep> yeeha
2008/08/15 [14:04] <+kshep> that's not what "the other way" meant
2008/08/15 [14:05] <+kshep> it's so when you're on identica you could see your friends on twitter
2008/08/15 [14:05] <+kshep> I thought. maybe I didn't understand.
2008/08/15 [14:05] <+scottag> The reason I unsub'ed because the prepended "identi.ca" was just more <censored> I had to ignore.
2008/08/15 [14:05] <+scottag> noise, basically
2008/08/15 [14:05] <+marccanter> openness
2008/08/15 [14:05] <+kevinmarks> open myths
2008/08/15 [14:05] <+marccanter> open <censored>
2008/08/15 [14:06] <@theagent> I will continue to argue that twitter/identi.ca etc is nothing more then ephemeral presence data
2008/08/15 [14:06] <+kshep> pro-DRO-mo
2008/08/15 [14:06] <+scottag> are you supposed to censor your speech here?
2008/08/15 [14:06] <+kevinmarks> myths are open source stories
2008/08/15 [14:06] <@theagent> and it should be located within your profile ie OpenID
2008/08/15 [14:06] <@theagent> the system censors here
2008/08/15 [14:06] <+scottag> so, you didn't see my s-word? :)
2008/08/15 [14:06] <+kevinmarks> no, the history is good too
2008/08/15 [14:06] <+marccanter> here's an idea
2008/08/15 [14:07] <+marccanter> I'll start a thread here and lets see if it migrates into teh conversation
2008/08/15 [14:07] <+marccanter> the MySpace openID implementation:
2008/08/15 [14:07] <+marccanter> myspace.com/marc
2008/08/15 [14:07] <+marccanter> is kind of nice and succinct - and certainly will translate nto OpenID-dom
2008/08/15 [14:07] <+marccanter> very nicely
2008/08/15 [14:07] <+marccanter> then I asked them - yesterday
2008/08/15 [14:07] <+scottag> I really can't stand myspace. got a page there, but only because I need one to communicate with some people on myspace.
2008/08/15 [14:07] <+marccanter> "when will you be a reliable party?"
2008/08/15 [14:08] <+marccanter> he said "soon"
2008/08/15 [14:08] <+marccanter> :-)
2008/08/15 [14:08] <+kshep> "I think the upper bounds is set by consensus "feel" for what "micro" means. You should feel somewhat restricted. 250-350 seems right." -- evan
2008/08/15 [14:08] <+kshep> nope. it works. it's just you, steve
2008/08/15 [14:08] <+kevinmarks> it was an irc convention
2008/08/15 [14:08] <+marccanter> that's what I remember
2008/08/15 [14:08] <+kevinmarks> but twitter picked it up form the community
2008/08/15 [14:08] <+kevinmarks> then broke the default
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+marccanter> on #joiito
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+kshep> irc convention is "username: "
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+kshep> at least that's what is seems to be these days
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+kshep> may have passed through @
2008/08/15 [14:09] <@TinaGillmor> tweet/dent link http://www.ustream.tv/channel/NewsGang-Live
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+treeshapiro> @ best
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+marccanter> but why 140?
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+EvanProdromou> 140?
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+kshep> 140 sms compat
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+EvanProdromou> It's an SMS limit
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+kshep> yay, Evan!
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+EvanProdromou> You can fit 140 bytes into an SMS message
2008/08/15 [14:09] <+kevinmarks> 140 is SMS 160 - 20 for the name
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+EvanProdromou> No
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+EvanProdromou> You can fit 160 7-bit chars in there if you pack them
2008/08/15 [14:10] <@theagent> name inclusion
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+kshep> sms is 160 7 bit characters or 140 8 bit
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+kevinmarks> there used to be a premium on having short names
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+kshep> or 70 16-bit characters in Kanji/Arabit
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+kshep> arabic
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+EvanProdromou> 70 2-byte chars, for Japanes and chinese and Arabic
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+EvanProdromou> Right
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+kshep> 140x8=160x7=70x16
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+kevinmarks> have you seen the UK protest icons?
2008/08/15 [14:10] <+EvanProdromou> So the whole thing is based on the ridiculous and broken SMS channel
2008/08/15 [14:11] <@theagent> except for the French
2008/08/15 [14:11] <@TinaGillmor> are you sure?
2008/08/15 [14:11] <+kshep> lowest common denominator
2008/08/15 [14:11] <+EvanProdromou> ridiculous, broken, and expensive
2008/08/15 [14:11] <+treeshapiro> @r@bit
2008/08/15 [14:11] <+EvanProdromou> ridiculous, broken, expensive, and monopolistic
2008/08/15 [14:11] <@theagent> the chat is censored but the stream isn't ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:11] <+kshep> ha
2008/08/15 [14:11] <@TinaGillmor> TREE !
2008/08/15 [14:11] <+treeshapiro> @ri@
2008/08/15 [14:11] <+EvanProdromou> Gah
2008/08/15 [14:11] <+kshep> that killed the audio
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+treeshapiro> oy
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+EvanProdromou> Had my volume down, now there lieder-singerin
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+scottag> MUTE
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+scottag> :)
2008/08/15 [14:12] <@theagent> I knew we'd finally get Marc to sing on this show
2008/08/15 [14:12] <@TinaGillmor> welcome back Tree
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+scottag> haha
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+jromeh> was that scripted?
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+marccanter> Erlkonig
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+treeshapiro> thanks tina
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+amyloo> Glad to see you back, tree
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+treeshapiro> hey @my
2008/08/15 [14:12] <@TinaGillmor> feeling better I hope
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+EvanProdromou> this is very pleasant
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+treeshapiro> i'll tell you when he finishes
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+jromeh> yes, good to see you, Tree
2008/08/15 [14:12] <+marccanter> Sonntag
2008/08/15 [14:13] <+treeshapiro> it IS friday
2008/08/15 [14:13] <+scottag> lovely
2008/08/15 [14:13] <@TinaGillmor> Friday follies
2008/08/15 [14:13] <+kshep> you muted, jerry?
2008/08/15 [14:13] <@theagent> sorry, Shazam couldn't identify that one
2008/08/15 [14:13] <@theagent> yes I'm muted
2008/08/15 [14:13] <@TinaGillmor> ah, Beatles
2008/08/15 [14:13] <+kshep> I mena you muted Marc? ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:13] <@theagent> no.. he's up
2008/08/15 [14:13] <+treeshapiro> good way to keep the kids in line, i bet
2008/08/15 [14:14] <+kshep> hmmm... no audio here
2008/08/15 [14:14] <@theagent> ok, my turn to sing Nirvana, Teen Spirit
2008/08/15 [14:14] <+EvanProdromou> Eric?
2008/08/15 [14:14] <+EvanProdromou> B-)
2008/08/15 [14:14] <@theagent> sorry guys but i won't have images and bugs up for you
2008/08/15 [14:14] <+kevinmarks> hello there
2008/08/15 [14:14] <+kshep> should we (I) be hearing something?
2008/08/15 [14:14] <+EvanProdromou> proh-DROH-moh
2008/08/15 [14:15] <@theagent> kshep. audio is up and running
2008/08/15 [14:15] <+kshep> sorry. glitch here.
2008/08/15 [14:15] <+treeshapiro> a-DOH-bee
2008/08/15 [14:16] <+treeshapiro> i think that might be a mistake
2008/08/15 [14:16] <+scottag> so, why would you want to be identified as "myspace.com/scottag"?
2008/08/15 [14:17] <+scottag> I don't think the identity information on myspace carries any weight.
2008/08/15 [14:17] <@theagent> I'm already OpenID on my own domain as both theagent.techaura.com and techaura.com/theagent
2008/08/15 [14:17] <+treeshapiro> >140, that is
2008/08/15 [14:17] <@theagent> listening to the stream he means
2008/08/15 [14:17] <@TinaGillmor> right
2008/08/15 [14:17] <+scottag> myspace is the "look good" place
2008/08/15 [14:17] <@theagent> myopenid.com support aliases to your profiles
2008/08/15 [14:18] <+scottag> I use myopenid.com too.
2008/08/15 [14:18] <+kevinmarks> myspace identity works for the people who care about myspace
2008/08/15 [14:18] <@theagent> LOl
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+kshep> twitter isn't 140. you can do more
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+kshep> but only 140 go out over sms
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+kshep> or do they split into multiple msgs?
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+marccanter> 350,000
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+williamsba> hey guys!
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+kshep> 4K
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+scottag> one of the main features of twitter is that tweets go to your phone.
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+treeshapiro> tumblr
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+williamsba> Steve doesn't like my bridge anymore :(
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+scottag> isn't that why?
2008/08/15 [14:19] <+kshep> http://laconi.ca/trac/wiki/messagelength
2008/08/15 [14:20] <@theagent> would appreciate you guys sending dents and tweets regarding the show url
2008/08/15 [14:20] <+exador23> magic number to hack proper grammar
2008/08/15 [14:20] <@theagent> http://ustream.tv/channel/newsgang-live
2008/08/15 [14:20] <+treeshapiro> 144 i think is the gold standard
032008/08/15 [14:20] * theagent changes topic to 'Friday Gillmor Gang starts at 10:45 PDT -- http://ustream.tv/channel/newsgang-live'
2008/08/15 [14:20] <+kshep> agree, tree. multiples of 12
2008/08/15 [14:21] <+treeshapiro> yesh. gross but true.
2008/08/15 [14:21] <+kshep> whatever twitter supports, +1
2008/08/15 [14:21] <+treeshapiro> egg counting.
2008/08/15 [14:21] <+kshep> people who care about sms = 80%+(?) of the mobile handheld market
2008/08/15 [14:22] <+treeshapiro> take it
2008/08/15 [14:22] <+kshep> what's the market penetration of handheld devices that support some client beyond SMS?
2008/08/15 [14:22] <+treeshapiro> to the limit
2008/08/15 [14:22] <+scottag> great point!
2008/08/15 [14:23] <+kshep> 140 is the lowest common denominator
2008/08/15 [14:23] <+scottag> (I actually came on here to pat Steve on the back.)
2008/08/15 [14:23] <+treeshapiro> sp@ceisthepl@ce
2008/08/15 [14:23] <+kshep> increasing it is elitist
2008/08/15 [14:23] <@TinaGillmor> we've missed your musical references, Tree
2008/08/15 [14:24] <+scottag> what happened to monocles?
2008/08/15 [14:24] <+kshep> it's like the plain test vs. html email holy war
2008/08/15 [14:24] <+exador23> I want mono radio back!
2008/08/15 [14:24] <+treeshapiro> bi-NOC-u-LARS
2008/08/15 [14:25] <+exador23> mono was such a simpler format.
2008/08/15 [14:25] <+kshep> it's fine if it's arbitrary
2008/08/15 [14:26] <+kshep> poll, Jerry?
2008/08/15 [14:26] <@theagent> maybe a good idea
2008/08/15 [14:26] <+treeshapiro> lbd
2008/08/15 [14:27] <+kshep> if you want to be verbost, post to tumblr, posterous, your blog, and dent a link
2008/08/15 [14:27] <+treeshapiro> verbost modernist
2008/08/15 [14:27] <+exador23> problem with 140 is it's killing language. yes.
2008/08/15 [14:27] <@theagent> the poll is up
2008/08/15 [14:27] <+kshep> I think haiku is dated. Let's go to 12 syl, 15 syl, 30, syl
2008/08/15 [14:27] <+treeshapiro> i respectfully disagree exador
2008/08/15 [14:27] <+kshep> the tech can support that now
2008/08/15 [14:27] <+kshep> uh... Jerry... 144?
2008/08/15 [14:27] <@theagent> you can find the poll at the bottom left of the video window
2008/08/15 [14:27] <+kevinmarks> XML is verbose, JSON is terse
2008/08/15 [14:28] <@theagent> oops
2008/08/15 [14:28] <+scottag> I think guns are killing people. yes.
2008/08/15 [14:28] <+treeshapiro> lawyers guns & money
2008/08/15 [14:28] <@theagent> ok.. poll fixed
2008/08/15 [14:28] <@TinaGillmor> well sometime you can find the poll there ... ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:28] <@theagent> back up
2008/08/15 [14:28] <@TinaGillmor> there we go
2008/08/15 [14:28] <+kshep> yay, polls
2008/08/15 [14:29] <@theagent> we have a lot more viewers then 2.. please vote on the poll
2008/08/15 [14:29] <+kevinmarks> got a url for that?
2008/08/15 [14:29] <+exador23> ok. it's dumbing down language. u c my pnt?
2008/08/15 [14:29] <+kshep> they're just fixing the 'in reply to' bug
2008/08/15 [14:29] <@theagent> POLL link is bottom left of video screen
2008/08/15 [14:30] <+treeshapiro> exador: i would make the argument that it's forcing a rethink of language
2008/08/15 [14:30] <+scottag> unanimous
2008/08/15 [14:30] <+kevinmarks> tina, if you want a pic for me theres one at kevinmarks.com
2008/08/15 [14:31] <+kshep> what's the margin of error in a 4vote sample size? ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:31] <@theagent> I have one up for you kev
2008/08/15 [14:31] <@theagent> it's off you blog
2008/08/15 [14:31] <+kevinmarks> OK
2008/08/15 [14:31] <@theagent> I'm the one doing all the video work you're watching
2008/08/15 [14:31] <+kevinmarks> ah, thoight that was tina
2008/08/15 [14:31] <+treeshapiro> little green door
2008/08/15 [14:32] <+kshep> poll: 4 votes for 140c, none for anything else
2008/08/15 [14:32] <+scottag> I use full words when I tweet. It actually forces me to be concise and to the point.
2008/08/15 [14:32] <+kshep> come on folks... there are 22 people here
2008/08/15 [14:32] <+kshep> <<<<<<<------------- poll
2008/08/15 [14:32] <+kshep> right under Kevin
2008/08/15 [14:32] <+scottag> we're the only four who matter :)
2008/08/15 [14:32] <+kshep> lower left hand corner
2008/08/15 [14:32] <+kshep> heh
2008/08/15 [14:33] <+kshep> 5 for 140, no votes for change
2008/08/15 [14:33] <+exador23> lack of innovation = death in tech world
2008/08/15 [14:33] <+treeshapiro> change is body surfing in hawaii
2008/08/15 [14:34] <+kshep> GG Poll seems unanimous against Change.
2008/08/15 [14:34] <+treeshapiro> how happy?
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+treeshapiro> oooh
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kshep> true
2008/08/15 [14:35] <@theagent> at the moment you couldn't be a container
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kshep> no, that's true
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+treeshapiro> wow
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+scottag> catfight!
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kshep> ah... kevin is Google
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kshep> and louder
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kshep> he wins
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+treeshapiro> do not press the red button
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kshep> no, you're right Evan
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kevinmarks> http://groups.google.com/group/opensocial-and-gadgets-spec
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+scottag> haha!
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kevinmarks> open spec group
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kevinmarks> sign up now evan
2008/08/15 [14:35] <@theagent> at the moment they released OpenSocial the container group was very limited. That is no longer the case
2008/08/15 [14:35] <@theagent> ShinDig
2008/08/15 [14:35] <+kevinmarks> i wat you there
2008/08/15 [14:36] <+treeshapiro> ok, i'm not sorry then in 140 characters or less
2008/08/15 [14:36] <+kshep> and what's up with Jaiku, Kevin?
2008/08/15 [14:36] <@TinaGillmor> This is the GILLMOR GANG
2008/08/15 [14:36] <+amyloo> if there's time, i'd love to hear what will be included in the new version of open social
2008/08/15 [14:36] <+treeshapiro> "that's absolute bollocks!" laughing
2008/08/15 [14:36] <@theagent> this show is going to do very well!
2008/08/15 [14:36] <+kevinmarks> http://www.opensocial.org/Technical-Resources/opensocial-spec-v08/restful-api-specification
2008/08/15 [14:37] <+treeshapiro> never mind the absolute bollocks
2008/08/15 [14:37] <+kevinmarks> current iteration of the spec, including activity sterams
2008/08/15 [14:37] <+treeshapiro> forget about the absolute bollocks
2008/08/15 [14:37] <+kshep> The lack of initial openness of the container spec was, I believe, a point of much consternation in the community
2008/08/15 [14:38] <+treeshapiro> deluding the momentum - mr feynman
2008/08/15 [14:38] <@theagent> we had a pretty good discussion about that point at BarCampLA5
2008/08/15 [14:39] <+kevinmarks> Open Source PHP implementation of OpenSocial APi that you cna sue in identi.ca
2008/08/15 [14:39] <+kevinmarks> http://incubator.apache.org/shindig/#php
2008/08/15 [14:39] <@theagent> use not sue ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:39] <@theagent> lol
2008/08/15 [14:39] <+treeshapiro> a-PACH-e
2008/08/15 [14:39] <+treeshapiro> a use named sue
2008/08/15 [14:39] <+kshep> oh, may, google throwing around the word sue? now we're in truble
2008/08/15 [14:39] <+exador23> if that's the case steve, then you are arguing for @ to work the same way.
2008/08/15 [14:39] <+kshep> ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:39] <+kevinmarks> use
2008/08/15 [14:39] <@theagent> starting to feel like #joiito on this show
2008/08/15 [14:40] <+kevinmarks> kshep: the process has been open since last november when ti was announced
2008/08/15 [14:40] <+kevinmarks> if you missed that I'm sorry
2008/08/15 [14:40] <+treeshapiro> veg@n frequent flyer
2008/08/15 [14:40] <@theagent> need to get lmorchard on the show
2008/08/15 [14:40] <+kshep> I didn't miss anything, Kevin
2008/08/15 [14:41] <+kshep> many people shared an opinion that Googles handling of the opensocial launch, container availablility, etc. wasn't as "open" as it could/should have been
2008/08/15 [14:41] <+kevinmarks> so what are you asking for?
2008/08/15 [14:41] <+treeshapiro> a kidney
2008/08/15 [14:41] <+kshep> I'm not asking for anything.
2008/08/15 [14:41] <+treeshapiro> golden toilet seat
2008/08/15 [14:41] <+treeshapiro> so that's a no?
2008/08/15 [14:42] <+kevinmarks> you're asking me to fix the past while ignoring the preent?
2008/08/15 [14:42] <+kshep> I'll have to go back and listen to this later, but I thought I heard Evan talking about the launch
2008/08/15 [14:42] <@theagent> kevinmarks, at the time of the announcement there was a lot of confusion in the community about the container side of OpenSocial... a lot of people speculated at the time container group was going to be scrutinized.
2008/08/15 [14:42] <+kshep> no, I'm not asking you anything kevin
2008/08/15 [14:42] <+kevinmarks> I agree there was confusion - this stuff is complex - I'm doing my best to explain it
2008/08/15 [14:42] <@theagent> most of us all know now that was not the case
2008/08/15 [14:42] <+kshep> I'm trying to explain how you were/are perceived by the community
2008/08/15 [14:42] <@TinaGillmor> Kshep and Scottag... thanks for the link dents
2008/08/15 [14:43] <+treeshapiro> xenu
2008/08/15 [14:43] <@TinaGillmor> Brad
2008/08/15 [14:43] <+williamsba> Brad Williams ;)
2008/08/15 [14:43] <+williamsba> lol
2008/08/15 [14:43] <+exador23> but you just argued identica needs to match twitter to gain users.
2008/08/15 [14:43] <+kevinmarks> which community are you purporting to speka for?
2008/08/15 [14:43] <+exador23> that means @ should work same way as an option
2008/08/15 [14:43] <@theagent> here comes Marc
2008/08/15 [14:43] <+scottag> LOVELY
2008/08/15 [14:43] <+kshep> nevermind kevin. this isn't going anywhere. sorry to get you fired up.
2008/08/15 [14:43] <@theagent> where at Apple?
2008/08/15 [14:44] <+treeshapiro> borst@l
2008/08/15 [14:44] <+scottag> ala minority report?
2008/08/15 [14:44] <+treeshapiro> wrost@l
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+treeshapiro> the wonder of it wall
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+treeshapiro> bullocks
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+kshep> maybe I can just find a couple links to blog posts/msg board comments from around the launch...
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+scottag> I LOVED THAT MOVIE
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+treeshapiro> mute
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+kevinmarks> I'm not interested about the misundetstandings then
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+kevinmarks> i'm interested in how i cna fix them now
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+treeshapiro> daniel miller
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+scottag> yay, vinny reily!
2008/08/15 [14:45] <+scottag> GET OUT OF HERE!
2008/08/15 [14:46] <@theagent> Brad, what link do you want below your pic?
2008/08/15 [14:46] <+kshep> well, make up your mind, Kevin
2008/08/15 [14:46] <+treeshapiro> yawn - exaggeration
2008/08/15 [14:46] <+kevinmarks> how can I get your chums to not ignore opensocial?
2008/08/15 [14:46] <@theagent> your name
2008/08/15 [14:46] <@TinaGillmor> Brad Williams
2008/08/15 [14:46] <+treeshapiro> read his <censored> bio - tim leary etc etc etc
2008/08/15 [14:46] <+jromeh> chicago, yes, but metro wasn't start
2008/08/15 [14:46] <+scottag> steve quit! oh, i should resub to him then
2008/08/15 [14:46] <+jromeh> house parties
2008/08/15 [14:46] <+kshep> do you want to know "which community are you purporting to speka for" or not? I can find link back to posts/comments if you do.
2008/08/15 [14:47] <@TinaGillmor> resub, block, follow, unfollow
2008/08/15 [14:47] <+hardaway-1> Tree Shapiro???? Hooray! How are you?
2008/08/15 [14:48] <+jromeh> poll now 6/0/0
2008/08/15 [14:48] <+kevinmarks> I want to know who is ignoring Opensocial "'cos it isn't open", so I can go and find then and show then the open spec, open foundation and open source implementations they can use
2008/08/15 [14:48] <+treeshapiro> hello francie!
2008/08/15 [14:48] <@TinaGillmor> amyloo ;-) thanks for the link dent
2008/08/15 [14:48] <@theagent> Brad.. link to a pic?
2008/08/15 [14:48] <+treeshapiro> what if, say, someone has five twitter accounts, just say?
2008/08/15 [14:49] <+kshep> gotcha, kevin
2008/08/15 [14:49] <+hardaway-1> Sitting in a seminar called "The Modern Bank Director" and have been told to think strategically, and then to get involved in people management. Huh?
2008/08/15 [14:49] <@TinaGillmor> that's a tall order
2008/08/15 [14:49] <@theagent> williamsba, link to a pic for you?
2008/08/15 [14:49] <+kshep> kevin: it may just be a matter of that initial impression that I'm not doing a good job of explaining
2008/08/15 [14:50] <+kshep> ...and overcoming that impression
2008/08/15 [14:50] <+hardaway-1> Wish I could listen
2008/08/15 [14:50] <+treeshapiro> did they show charlie chaplin films to get you all roused up a la tony robbins? francie?
2008/08/15 [14:50] <@theagent> we have a running poll for all you new viewers.. you can find it at the lower left of the video stream
2008/08/15 [14:50] <+hardaway-1> I wish!
2008/08/15 [14:50] <+exador23> only if you're subscribed
2008/08/15 [14:51] <+hardaway-1> I voted
2008/08/15 [14:51] <+kevinmarks> we had such an explosion of interest originlly that we were not doing much publicity work for 6 months to let the engineers work together
2008/08/15 [14:51] <+treeshapiro> never mind the bloody rocky mountain oysters
2008/08/15 [14:52] <+scottag> here here
2008/08/15 [14:52] <+exador23> yes. I agree.
2008/08/15 [14:52] <+jromeh> settings issue
2008/08/15 [14:53] <+treeshapiro> faulty
2008/08/15 [14:54] <+treeshapiro> defaulty towers
2008/08/15 [14:54] <+scottag> wha?
2008/08/15 [14:54] <+jromeh> filters out @replies to people you don't follow from people who you do follow
2008/08/15 [14:54] <@theagent> we have a running poll for all you new viewers.. you can find it at the lower left of the video stream
2008/08/15 [14:54] <+scottag> discoverability is the only real value of twitter, actually.
2008/08/15 [14:55] <+treeshapiro> to see or not see
2008/08/15 [14:55] <+scottag> twitterspy does a pretty decent job (as far as I can tell)
2008/08/15 [14:55] <+kshep> kevin: I think one of the more visible posts RE initial lack of "openness" was Tim O'Reilly: http://radar.oreilly.com/2007/11/opensocial-its-the-data-stupid.html
2008/08/15 [14:55] <+kshep> (and yeah, I'm that first commenter ;-)
2008/08/15 [14:55] <+scottag> actually, random conversations between people I follow matter less to me than conversations I'm explictly interested in
2008/08/15 [14:55] <+Jari_Ra> The poll is quite cool...
2008/08/15 [14:56] <+treeshapiro> i actually forget about it sometimes... replies tab
2008/08/15 [14:56] <+treeshapiro> seizuremc
2008/08/15 [14:56] <+kshep> I HATE the replies tab. I just want everything in one stream.
2008/08/15 [14:57] <+kshep> Would be nice to create your own tabs corresponding to filters
2008/08/15 [14:57] <+treeshapiro> unbroke
2008/08/15 [14:57] <+scottag> I never use twitter on the twitter site.
2008/08/15 [14:57] <+exador23> the option to not receive 1/2 conversations means people must unfollow to escape the flood
2008/08/15 [14:58] <+exador23> as a result it hinders replying. its a choice issue
2008/08/15 [14:58] <+kshep> no... public feed is still the default
2008/08/15 [14:58] <+kshep> hmmm... is there a ticket for that...?
2008/08/15 [14:58] <+kevinmarks> and tim was missing the point of
2008/08/15 [14:58] <+treeshapiro> #czeck zizek
2008/08/15 [14:59] <+treeshapiro> you can run
2008/08/15 [14:59] <+kshep> it's open source. users request everything and anything
2008/08/15 [14:59] <+kshep> there are conflicting requests in the ticket DB
2008/08/15 [15:00] <+kevinmarks> kshep: i was the 5th commenter - tim was missing the point obout combining IDs that not everyone wants them all joined
2008/08/15 [15:00] <+kevinmarks> you don't necessarily want your Linkedin ID and Suicidegirls ID linked
2008/08/15 [15:00] <+kshep> Re the identica replies tab... http://laconi.ca/trac/ticket/284
2008/08/15 [15:01] <+exador23> there should be a way to hide for those who want that
2008/08/15 [15:01] <@theagent> correct.. distinct identities that also have distinct contexts
2008/08/15 [15:01] <+treeshapiro> yeah, gee, i must protect my suicide girls id at all costs
2008/08/15 [15:01] <+treeshapiro> and my nerve
2008/08/15 [15:01] <+treeshapiro> and my dignity
2008/08/15 [15:02] <+exador23> good point evan.
2008/08/15 [15:03] <+kshep> cool, kevin. I need to go back and look at the opensocial stuff again. I was one of those folks who got an initial bad taste, but left it at that. got no ill will or anthing, just stuck with that intial impression
2008/08/15 [15:03] <+treeshapiro> grasshopper
2008/08/15 [15:04] <@theagent> kshep, go take a look at Dave Johnson's work with something called SocialSite too
2008/08/15 [15:04] <+scottag> ir-what?
2008/08/15 [15:04] <+scottag> love Steve's lizard brain
2008/08/15 [15:04] <+kevinmarks> is that the Sun thing?
2008/08/15 [15:05] <@theagent> kevinmarks, yes
2008/08/15 [15:05] <+kevinmarks> thats neat
2008/08/15 [15:05] <+treeshapiro> oh sorry
2008/08/15 [15:05] <+treeshapiro> my six g3s
2008/08/15 [15:05] <+kshep> poll is 8 for "leave it at 140", 2 for "I want more" , btw
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+kshep> 32 people here... only 10 votes...
2008/08/15 [15:06] <@theagent> we have a running poll for all you new viewers.. you can find it at the lower left of the video stream
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+kshep> there's a little "poll" link under brad's name
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+kevinmarks> the initial release had the point of integration in the browser in javascript - with 0.8 we have server-to-serve REST APIs agreed and integrated
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+donbonaddio> so how do we move the Woodstock concert from NY and not lose anyone, take the "bridge"?
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+treeshapiro> bikini atoll
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+exador23> we need portable social networks.
2008/08/15 [15:06] <@TinaGillmor> please vote... it's your civic duty
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+kevinmarks> portable is the wrong word
2008/08/15 [15:06] <@TinaGillmor> poll button at bottom left of video window
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+treeshapiro> potable poatables for 500 alex
2008/08/15 [15:06] <+kevinmarks> we need fungible ones
2008/08/15 [15:07] <+treeshapiro> -a
2008/08/15 [15:07] <+exador23> @tina I've already voted on identica.
2008/08/15 [15:07] <@TinaGillmor> ah
2008/08/15 [15:07] <+kshep> good deal, kevin. the server-server stuff was what I wanted, and when the initial stuff was client and js, something else shiny got my attention ;-)
2008/08/15 [15:07] <+kevinmarks> right
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+kevinmarks> the first draft of server to server didn't make sesne to the containers - the current one does
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+EvanProdromou> kevinmarks, I want to talk after the show
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+kshep> heck, I actually blogged about it. yikes. http://bit.ly/3NWzlx
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+treeshapiro> 140 characters of bad road
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+kevinmarks> that is the result of severla months of discussion in the community
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+kshep> not that I really 'blog'
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+kshep> heh
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+kevinmarks> love to, evan
2008/08/15 [15:08] <@TinaGillmor> Steve sounds a little pissed when he says "Brad"
2008/08/15 [15:08] <+kevinmarks> kevinmarks@google.com
2008/08/15 [15:09] <@TinaGillmor> just a little, to me
2008/08/15 [15:09] <+treeshapiro> you oughta know
2008/08/15 [15:09] <@theagent> EvanProdromou, you'd be pressed to find a better person to talk with...
2008/08/15 [15:09] <+kevinmarks> solving the auth issue was a hard part of that, OAuth provides a good answer
2008/08/15 [15:10] <+kevinmarks> with the hosted gadgets the auth issue was much simpler
2008/08/15 [15:10] <@theagent> we need ZeroConf for microblogging...
2008/08/15 [15:10] <+treeshapiro> sorry, but does brad's pic look a little like a cell phone snap taken on visiting day at sing-sing?
2008/08/15 [15:10] <+exador23> you're providing tools for ~people~ to talk to each other
2008/08/15 [15:10] <@theagent> treeshapiro, pulled it from his own blog... don't blame me ;-)
2008/08/15 [15:11] <+treeshapiro> "tell dave the shoe to give me a call"
2008/08/15 [15:11] <@theagent> This is going to be a Gillmor Gang for the books.
2008/08/15 [15:11] <+kshep> what movie is that from... "It's not the (something something something), BRAD..."
2008/08/15 [15:11] <+scottag> this is the GILLMOR GANG after all :)
2008/08/15 [15:12] <+marccanter> I gotta go
2008/08/15 [15:12] <+marccanter> bye
2008/08/15 [15:12] <+kshep> later, marc
2008/08/15 [15:12] <+kshep> I want 2-way comm with twitter, but pull from identica, not push from twitter
2008/08/15 [15:12] <@theagent> thanks for the time marc
2008/08/15 [15:13] <@TinaGillmor> bye Marc... thanks for the tunes especially
2008/08/15 [15:13] <+exador23> if you can have conversations with your network on twitter via identica, when twitter goes down huge masses will come. they don't want to leave their network behind. this solves that
2008/08/15 [15:13] <+kshep> exador23++
2008/08/15 [15:13] <+kshep> coming to identica should get you "everthing you have on twitter, plus..."
2008/08/15 [15:14] <+treeshapiro> "the shoebox is under the toolshed"
2008/08/15 [15:14] <+kshep> everything = your twitter graph
2008/08/15 [15:14] <+kshep> IF you want it
2008/08/15 [15:15] <+exador23> more cowbell!
2008/08/15 [15:15] <+shareme> I miised marc canteer
2008/08/15 [15:15] <+treeshapiro> "tell my <censored> lawyer to <censored> call already"
2008/08/15 [15:15] <+scottag> more cowwhale
2008/08/15 [15:15] <@TinaGillmor> shareme... yes you did
2008/08/15 [15:16] <+treeshapiro> "wtf am i paying him for?"
2008/08/15 [15:16] <+kshep> BAH!
2008/08/15 [15:16] <+kshep> can't check
2008/08/15 [15:16] <+exador23> unfortunately if you just drop the identica: prepend twitter ignores starting @s
2008/08/15 [15:16] <@theagent> this is such a freaking kludge
2008/08/15 [15:16] <+treeshapiro> how do you work this thing?
2008/08/15 [15:17] <+kshep> @francine @hardaway is a good example
2008/08/15 [15:17] <+treeshapiro> maybe you plug it in
2008/08/15 [15:17] <+scottag> it's like the ol' heated bicycle handlebar problem
2008/08/15 [15:17] <+treeshapiro> bullocks
2008/08/15 [15:17] <+kshep> @hardaway:t = @francine:i
2008/08/15 [15:17] <+kshep> but @hardway: is is @francine:i's daughter
2008/08/15 [15:17] <+exador23> solution? make "from identica" appear on instead of "from web" etc.
2008/08/15 [15:17] <+treeshapiro> @bloodynorthlondonaccent
2008/08/15 [15:18] <@theagent> we have a running poll for all you new viewers.. you can find it at the lower left of the video stream
2008/08/15 [15:18] <+kshep> to do that, exador23, you've got to get twitter to approve identica as a source for 'from' in the api
2008/08/15 [15:18] <+treeshapiro> omgz
2008/08/15 [15:19] <+treeshapiro> 140 explanations or less
2008/08/15 [15:19] <+exador23> but if they would in exchange for no prepend @'s would work the same way they do now on twitter
2008/08/15 [15:19] <+kevinmarks> north london ftw, but I can be more BBC if you prefer
2008/08/15 [15:20] <+kshep> What do you folks think about adopting some sort of service designation, ala @stevegillmor:twitter vs @stevegillmor:identica?
2008/08/15 [15:20] <+treeshapiro> go a little michael caine - could ya?
2008/08/15 [15:20] <+scottag> grow up?
2008/08/15 [15:20] <+treeshapiro> c sleuth
2008/08/15 [15:20] <+shareme> hehe
2008/08/15 [15:20] <+kevinmarks> not in 140 chars
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+kevinmarks> on the web version, just put a different link in
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+scottag> oh, man, more noise to the conversation?
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+kevinmarks> the way to do it is to make the identica UI subsume the twitter linking
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+kshep> what if there were a central service to disambiuate, ala DNS, i-name, etc.
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+scottag> having a single "@" is about as much noise in a 140 character message I can bear.
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+kevinmarks> so using identica gets twitetr linsk tight
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+scottag> But that's just me
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+treeshapiro> Noice.
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+kevinmarks> there is it's called URLs
2008/08/15 [15:21] <+kshep> so you could just do @kevinmarks:t, @kevinmarks:j, etc
2008/08/15 [15:22] <+treeshapiro> free brad
2008/08/15 [15:22] <+scottag> people who follow who don't give a rat's arse?
2008/08/15 [15:23] <+kevinmarks> twitters @namespace is more succesful than inames
2008/08/15 [15:23] <+kshep> oh, heck yeah it is
2008/08/15 [15:23] <+exador23> it discouraging replying if you know listeners are ~forced~ to be seen
2008/08/15 [15:23] <+exador23> damn 140
2008/08/15 [15:23] <+treeshapiro> michael caine, c'mon
2008/08/15 [15:23] <+kshep> poll is 11 to 4 to keep 140 right now
2008/08/15 [15:23] <+treeshapiro> we know you can
2008/08/15 [15:24] <+treeshapiro> you know you want to
2008/08/15 [15:24] <+exador23> if listeners don't have option to not see one's @replies, courtesy demands you reply less
2008/08/15 [15:24] <+exador23> therefor it reduces conversations.
2008/08/15 [15:24] <+treeshapiro> son, your career is going to be severely limited if that's the only accent you can do
2008/08/15 [15:25] <+kshep> the same problem exists between federated laconica instances, so this isn't just "us" vs. "them"
2008/08/15 [15:25] <+kshep> each laconica instnace has a unique namespace
2008/08/15 [15:25] <+scottag> LUNCH
2008/08/15 [15:25] <+treeshapiro> describe your lunch in 140
2008/08/15 [15:25] <+exador23> @stevegilmor you are reversing your 140char argument that identica needs to be the same as twitter to seduce users
2008/08/15 [15:26] <+kshep> have it in public online so people don't have to take time off work and fly somewhere
2008/08/15 [15:26] <+kshep> ugh. camp.
2008/08/15 [15:27] <+treeshapiro> 2nd man to have baby!
2008/08/15 [15:27] <+kshep> microblog.org
2008/08/15 [15:27] <@theagent> last chance for poll
2008/08/15 [15:27] <+kshep> is free for folks to use as coordination
2008/08/15 [15:27] <+exador23> the users want to not be inundated with everyone's @ reply
2008/08/15 [15:27] <+scottag> thats for sure
2008/08/15 [15:27] <+kshep> use configurable filters
2008/08/15 [15:27] <@TinaGillmor> thanks everyone
2008/08/15 [15:28] <+scottag> that's why track is so important.
2008/08/15 [15:28] <+jromeh> exador _some_ users
2008/08/15 [15:29] <+exador23> yes. jromeh. they want the option. i want to see all the @s myself
2008/08/15 [15:29] <@stevegillmor> exador I am not reversing anything. the conversation had to stop but will continue
2008/08/15 [15:29] <+treeshapiro> blood on the tracks
2008/08/15 [15:29] <@stevegillmor> welcome back tree
2008/08/15 [15:29] <+treeshapiro> thanks steve
2008/08/15 [15:30] <+jromeh> tree yesterday saw someone cite bott as their fave from the year 1970
2008/08/15 [15:30] <+exador23> steve you argued well for 140char because you want to seduce away from twitter by working the same that should apply to options to make @s work the same way.
2008/08/15 [15:31] <+jromeh> someone else replied that they'd obviously had it on a long advance as the rest of us didn't hear it until 74/75
2008/08/15 [15:31] <+treeshapiro> beck is a scientologist
2008/08/15 [15:31] <@stevegillmor> exad I haven't finished arguing about @ so don't assume u understand that which hasn't been argued
2008/08/15 [15:32] <+jromeh> believe it's ok to choose a better default behavior
2008/08/15 [15:32] <+jromeh> and supply same options
2008/08/15 [15:32] <+kshep> didn't have any time to talk track. part II, eh
2008/08/15 [15:33] <+treeshapiro> track talk - sounds like bb ref.
2008/08/15 [15:35] <+shareme> if trc worked as hoped we would not need @ at all :)
2008/08/15 [15:36] <+kshep> no, you still would, sharme
2008/08/15 [15:37] <+kshep> or at least it's still of some use
2008/08/15 [15:37] <@stevegillmor> correct shareme but @ could be optional
2008/08/15 [15:37] <+kshep> yeah, @ is shorthand for clients that you're ref. to a user
2008/08/15 [15:37] <+williamsba> maybe the answer is an open platform to store user account names across all services? With an open API of course
2008/08/15 [15:38] <+shareme> yes @ optional would work
2008/08/15 [15:38] <+kshep> there've been some discussions around a directory service of sorts
2008/08/15 [15:38] <+shareme> a ldap for web 2.0 users?
2008/08/15 [15:39] <@stevegillmor> I disagree, brad, and will not resume using bridge if you filter @
2008/08/15 [15:39] <+kshep> many different techs thrown around
2008/08/15 [15:39] <@theagent> what the hell do I need a directory service for when I have an extensible OpenID and a URI
2008/08/15 [15:39] <@stevegillmor> URI game over
2008/08/15 [15:39] <+shareme> ture openID is thelogical directory
2008/08/15 [15:40] <+kshep> well, need some way to map from @user to URI, no?
2008/08/15 [15:41] <@theagent> passed via your OpenID credential and persisted at the service.
2008/08/15 [15:41] <+kshep> I'm Twhirl, and somebody user @stevegillmor in a140char message... how do I resolve that to a URI?
2008/08/15 [15:42] <+shareme> openID uri#alias at service?
2008/08/15 [15:42] <@theagent> kshep, not suggesting there wouldn't need to be wholesale adoption of whatever central service got picked
2008/08/15 [15:42] <@theagent> but the idea of creating <censored> maps between services is <censored> absurd
2008/08/15 [15:43] <+shareme> os each serice shoudl do say openId rui+alias at service p[rofiel page say or soemthing like it?
2008/08/15 [15:44] <+shareme> mine soem easy becasu eI usually use the same uername form openID to services
2008/08/15 [15:44] <@theagent> I don't have all the answers but surely don't want to propagate some half ass implementation
2008/08/15 [15:44] <+shareme> true no on edoes :)
2008/08/15 [15:45] <+kshep> speak for yourself ;-)
2008/08/15 [15:45] <@theagent> I did a initial project called FlashID in 97 so some of these things my R&D played with...
2008/08/15 [15:45] <@theagent> need to find the archive of that work
2008/08/15 [15:45] <+shareme> and we do not want something tightly coupled, too many problems
2008/08/15 [15:54] <+petertsantilli> Hey everybody!
2008/08/15 [15:57] <@stevegillmor> doing something different today, invite only to call for Fridays
2008/08/15 [15:58] <+shareme> sounds interesting
2008/08/15 [15:58] <+kr8tr> I love me some Friday!
2008/08/15 [15:59] <+petertsantilli> so...if we weren't invited, should we leave? :)
2008/08/15 [16:00] <@theagent> its more fun to heckle from the back channel anyways
2008/08/15 [16:00] <@theagent> ;-)
2008/08/15 [16:00] <+petertsantilli> no audio?
2008/08/15 [16:00] <@theagent> hold on.. firefox acting badly again..
2008/08/15 [16:01] <@theagent> yepp... firefox went bye bye
2008/08/15 [16:01] <@theagent> give me one minute
2008/08/15 [16:01] <+BruceLerner> So who are we not listening to?
2008/08/15 [16:01] <+petertsantilli> ................................................
2008/08/15 [16:01] <+petertsantilli> soon find out
2008/08/15 [16:01] <@stevegillmor> we're waiting for u to come back on line
2008/08/15 [16:01] <+petertsantilli> NOBODY is invited
2008/08/15 [16:01] <@theagent> 1 minute
2008/08/15 [16:01] <+jcposner> high steve
2008/08/15 [16:02] <@stevegillmor> hi jim
2008/08/15 [16:02] <+jcposner> call back pin is not working
2008/08/15 [16:02] <+petertsantilli> Everyone must leave now
2008/08/15 [16:02] <+kshep> no call set up in calliflower that I can see
2008/08/15 [16:02] <@theagent> ok.. we're up
2008/08/15 [16:03] <@theagent> steve.. vid is stable on this box.. so you can skype in to me
2008/08/15 [16:03] <+kshep> uh
2008/08/15 [16:03] <+kshep> how does one get on the call?
2008/08/15 [16:03] <+kshep> oh
2008/08/15 [16:04] <+kshep> nice
2008/08/15 [16:04] <+kshep> interesting
2008/08/15 [16:04] <+petertsantilli> very interesting
2008/08/15 [16:04] <+kshep> should be much better show today
2008/08/15 [16:05] <+petertsantilli> much better
2008/08/15 [16:05] <+petertsantilli> mute me, and we're fine
2008/08/15 [16:05] <+kshep> no, I'm off too, peter
2008/08/15 [16:05] <+kshep> not just you
2008/08/15 [16:06] <+kshep> didn't hear if christian made the cut
2008/08/15 [16:06] <+kshep> or bruce
2008/08/15 [16:06] <+petertsantilli> Web Pixie on the call?
2008/08/15 [16:06] <+kshep> yes
2008/08/15 [16:06] <+BruceLerner> No. Didn't make the cut.
2008/08/15 [16:07] <+BruceLerner> Christian mentioned earlier that he wasn't available.
2008/08/15 [16:08] <+BruceLerner> Wish I was inb Hawaii eating ice cream with my kids.
2008/08/15 [16:08] <+donbonaddio> she doesn't want it
2008/08/15 [16:09] <+petertsantilli> WTF is he saying? Didn;t he schellack me on my first call-in because he thought Obama would commit political suicide if he didn't pick Hillary?
2008/08/15 [16:09] <+WebPixie> yes
2008/08/15 [16:10] <+WebPixie> no
2008/08/15 [16:11] <+Abierto_cc> have they discussed Hillary putting her name forward on the floor for nomination to first chair?
2008/08/15 [16:11] <+kshep> no, abierto
2008/08/15 [16:11] <+Karoli> petertsantilli he still thinks she should be on the ticket. just doesn't think she will be
2008/08/15 [16:11] <+Abierto_cc> doesn't that seem odd somehow?
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+Abierto_cc> that she would have a floor fight?
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+kshep> not a floor fight
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+kshep> just a figurative nomination
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+Abierto_cc> what do you call it?
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+Abierto_cc> ahhh... figurative
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+Abierto_cc> that's a PR thing I guess
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+kshep> my understanding, yes
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+shareme> doe stha tlaso apply for bank or financialcompanies?
2008/08/15 [16:12] <+kshep> could be wrong
2008/08/15 [16:13] <+Abierto_cc> 90% of how many?
2008/08/15 [16:13] <+shareme> hee is an intersitng cycle regualte a portionof finance and leaches go to ne area tosindle
2008/08/15 [16:13] <+Abierto_cc> what was their net income?
2008/08/15 [16:14] <@TinaGillmor> tweet link http://www.ustream.tv/channel/NewsGang-Live
2008/08/15 [16:14] <@TinaGillmor> ...and dent
2008/08/15 [16:14] <+shareme> as a corp if you have large foreginincome yu never pay fed income taxes..se GM example
2008/08/15 [16:15] <+petertsantilli> Rob...with hair
2008/08/15 [16:15] <@TinaGillmor> shoot, Tree's not here.... was in chat on GG earlier... first time in a while
2008/08/15 [16:15] <+shareme> MS just elimanted mos o fheir state taxes
2008/08/15 [16:16] <+donbonaddio> in the end the investors(us) pay the taxes for big corps or people lose their job
2008/08/15 [16:16] <+Abierto_cc> no loopholes except that one
2008/08/15 [16:16] <+jromeh> figure out a slogan and run with it!
2008/08/15 [16:17] <+Abierto_cc> BS
2008/08/15 [16:17] <+petertsantilli> You guys should have a show called TaxGangLive...very interesting topic
2008/08/15 [16:17] <+Abierto_cc> BS
2008/08/15 [16:17] <+petertsantilli> Taxes are all over the news
2008/08/15 [16:17] <+Abierto_cc> what's wrong with socialism exactly????
2008/08/15 [16:17] <@TinaGillmor> ahhhh...
2008/08/15 [16:18] <+Abierto_cc> "That's called socialism." ooooo scary
2008/08/15 [16:18] <+donbonaddio> Rob's a smart guy
2008/08/15 [16:18] <+petertsantilli> Rob calling "socialism" again...
2008/08/15 [16:18] <+petertsantilli> Rob needs a ciggie
2008/08/15 [16:18] <+alexbellinger1> HRC wants Obama to win. But knows he'll be in trouble with economy after 4 years. She can step in when economic cycle looks up.
2008/08/15 [16:19] <+donbonaddio> why would she take it if she's not sure she could win?
2008/08/15 [16:20] <+petertsantilli> ...just to help the guy win the Presidency....and go to funerals
2008/08/15 [16:20] <+petertsantilli> that's it
2008/08/15 [16:20] <+Abierto_cc> if he's nominated, democrats should support him
2008/08/15 [16:21] <+WebPixie> break tie votes in senate?
2008/08/15 [16:21] <+kr8tr> If he is nominated, and HRC isn;t on the ticker, REPs should support hime :)
2008/08/15 [16:22] <+Abierto_cc> it's BS, unless it's a floor fight
2008/08/15 [16:22] <+petertsantilli> I prefer the fight outside in the parking lot
2008/08/15 [16:22] <+Abierto_cc> mud rassling in denver
2008/08/15 [16:22] <+WebPixie> it's all orchestrated anyway; the primary is over
2008/08/15 [16:23] <+Abierto_cc> Dewey
2008/08/15 [16:23] <+WebPixie> the parking lot may be a dangerous place, right
2008/08/15 [16:24] <+WebPixie> headline: dewey wins!
2008/08/15 [16:24] <+Abierto_cc> this is a case of supporting our only surving first family
2008/08/15 [16:24] <+Abierto_cc> surviving
2008/08/15 [16:25] <+Abierto_cc> anyone seen the Harold and Jumar flick?
2008/08/15 [16:26] <+Abierto_cc> Kumar
2008/08/15 [16:26] <+Abierto_cc> Harold and Kumar go to Denver?
2008/08/15 [16:26] <+Abierto_cc> republican convention is when?
2008/08/15 [16:27] <+Abierto_cc> good graphic
2008/08/15 [16:28] <+WebPixie> week after the dem's convention
2008/08/15 [16:28] <+amyloo> can't wait for the debates... think it will be even more important than the conventions
2008/08/15 [16:28] <+WebPixie> ??
2008/08/15 [16:29] <+Abierto_cc> think the Days of rage in St. paul will polarize voters?
2008/08/15 [16:29] <+Karoli> sigh, got dropped
2008/08/15 [16:30] <+Abierto_cc> or letterman
2008/08/15 [16:30] <+petertsantilli> francine...turn your volume down
2008/08/15 [16:30] <+shareme> ther are so mahy cpations we could do for that image
2008/08/15 [16:31] <+petertsantilli> HRC looks like she has a shiner
2008/08/15 [16:31] <+Abierto_cc> both at same place at same time speaking sequentially
2008/08/15 [16:32] <+Abierto_cc> to ztian cultists
2008/08/15 [16:32] <+shareme> yawn fest
2008/08/15 [16:32] <+Abierto_cc> xtian, not ztian
2008/08/15 [16:32] <@TinaGillmor> audio ?
2008/08/15 [16:32] <@TinaGillmor> back
2008/08/15 [16:32] <+alexbellinger1> karoli when are you starting your newsletter?
2008/08/15 [16:32] <+shareme> hehe
2008/08/15 [16:32] <@theagent> audio is solid here
2008/08/15 [16:33] <+mobilejones> Hey guys I've been trying to get into the call for 30 mins with no luck.
2008/08/15 [16:33] <@TinaGillmor> ok now... was momentary Jerry
2008/08/15 [16:33] <+shareme> McCain has faith in something? cannot tel form his speeches
2008/08/15 [16:33] <+petertsantilli> who's that?
2008/08/15 [16:33] <+mobilejones> No email from Calliflower and phone system not recognizing my registered phone number either.
2008/08/15 [16:33] <+petertsantilli> Who is that?
2008/08/15 [16:34] <+Abierto_cc> mean tv
2008/08/15 [16:34] <+WebPixie> amyloo
2008/08/15 [16:34] <+mobilejones> Ah, great.
2008/08/15 [16:34] <+Abierto_cc> "they?"
2008/08/15 [16:34] <+mobilejones> So, I'm booted from the show. A notice of that fact would have saved me some time.
2008/08/15 [16:35] <+Abierto_cc> conspiracy theorists?
2008/08/15 [16:35] <+mobilejones> Thanks.
2008/08/15 [16:35] <+Abierto_cc> what about the lone guy with the gun
2008/08/15 [16:35] <+donbonaddio> look how far we've come - voting for looks, sheesh
2008/08/15 [16:35] <+donbonaddio> guess Edwards is the exception that proves that rule
2008/08/15 [16:35] <+petertsantilli> MobileJones...you're not missing anything, Steve took the steering wheel
2008/08/15 [16:36] <+petertsantilli> Abierto...
2008/08/15 [16:36] <+Abierto_cc> overconfidence in the chat room: abierto says it'll be a fifty state sweep
2008/08/15 [16:37] <+jromeh> all sorts of republicans try to predict that overconfidence will bring down the O campaign
2008/08/15 [16:37] <+jromeh> "if we say it enough, we can get people to believe it!"
2008/08/15 [16:37] <+petertsantilli> I cared about Cheney
2008/08/15 [16:37] <+Abierto_cc> accepting was the most difficult decision Johnson had to make
2008/08/15 [16:38] <+Abierto_cc> wouldn't have accepted if he hadn't had the deal with the oil mafia
2008/08/15 [16:38] <+petertsantilli> funerals
2008/08/15 [16:38] <+petertsantilli> ..just to help the guy win the Presidency....and go to funerals
2008/08/15 [16:39] <+Abierto_cc> insured his doom
2008/08/15 [16:39] <+Abierto_cc> hardball with the Dallas deal
2008/08/15 [16:39] <+Abierto_cc> 1000 days
2008/08/15 [16:40] <+Abierto_cc> January 61 thru Novemebr 63
2008/08/15 [16:40] <+alexbellinger1> Cheney's a strong VP, isn't he?
2008/08/15 [16:40] <+petertsantilli> Cheney's too strong
2008/08/15 [16:41] <+petertsantilli> Bush delegated all the "decision making" to Cheney
2008/08/15 [16:41] <+Abierto_cc> what about GHW Bush under the senile old <censored>
2008/08/15 [16:43] <+shareme> no GHW Bush under Reagon as nueturered
2008/08/15 [16:43] <+Abierto_cc> GHW Bush was enormously powerful, pulling along the entire intelligence community
2008/08/15 [16:43] <+Abierto_cc> not
2008/08/15 [16:44] <+Abierto_cc> we owed it to florida since the havana thing got messed up by the godless commies
2008/08/15 [16:44] <+Abierto_cc> edwards was the best choice
2008/08/15 [16:44] <+Abierto_cc> Edwards AFB, not John
2008/08/15 [16:45] <+Abierto_cc> no, Hillary won't move us toward socialized medicine which is our only hope out of the managed care muddle
2008/08/15 [16:48] <+jromeh> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saul_Alinsky
2008/08/15 [16:49] <+alexbellinger1> BS
2008/08/15 [16:49] <+jromeh> "Alinsky championed new ways to organize the poor and powerless that created a backyard revolution in cities across America."
2008/08/15 [16:49] <+jromeh> some guy from Chicago ;)
2008/08/15 [16:49] <+ChristianBurns> Is this a special edition? I didnt get an invite and calliflower wont let me in?
2008/08/15 [16:50] <+BruceLerner> CB - invite only Fridays
2008/08/15 [16:50] <+jromeh> They must feel so frustrated, so defeated, so lost, so futureless in the prevailing system that they are willing to let go of the past and change the future. This acceptance is the reformation essential to any revolution.
2008/08/15 [16:51] <+ChristianBurns> Is that a new thing? I dont mind
2008/08/15 [16:51] <+Abierto_cc> And everybody knows that the plague is comingEverybody knows that its moving fastEverybody knows that the naked man and womanAre just a shining artifact of the pastEverybody knows the scene is deadBut there’s gonna be a meter on your bedThat will discloseWhat everybody knows
2008/08/15 [16:51] <+jromeh> To bring on this reformation requires that the organizer work inside the system, among not only the middle class but the 40 per cent of American families - more than seventy million people - whose income range from $5,000 to $10,000 a year [in 1971].
2008/08/15 [16:52] <+alexbellinger1> Russia is Yahoo
2008/08/15 [16:52] <+alexbellinger1> US is Microsoft
2008/08/15 [16:52] <+alexbellinger1> China is Google ;)
2008/08/15 [16:52] <+BruceLerner> Steve dropped it in the chat as show was starting
2008/08/15 [16:53] <@theagent> OBLITERATE!
2008/08/15 [16:54] <+Karoli> @alexbellinger1 interesting assignmentes there
2008/08/15 [16:54] <+petertsantilli> "HillaryGangLive"
2008/08/15 [16:56] <+petertsantilli> ...so....let's be tough and threaten with missiles cuz we're defenders of oil ---- I mean --- democracy
2008/08/15 [16:56] <@theagent> she's full of gas?
2008/08/15 [16:56] <+shareme> She lights the Fuse?
2008/08/15 [16:56] <@theagent> her tap is shut off? (might explain lewinsky)
2008/08/15 [16:56] <+donbonaddio> it's hers in 2012
2008/08/15 [16:57] <+alexbellinger1> Bush encouraged Georgia to invade Russia. Then planted missiles in Poland. This favours secruity and McCain. meaning that HRC has to be VP to counter.
2008/08/15 [16:57] <+petertsantilli> It's all speculative...
2008/08/15 [16:57] <@TinaGillmor> ooooh, Alex... good theory
2008/08/15 [16:58] <+petertsantilli> nice Alex...thought worthy
2008/08/15 [16:58] <@theagent> He's going to manage the White House humador
2008/08/15 [16:59] <+donbonaddio> haha theagent
2008/08/15 [16:59] <+alexbellinger1> Hot Wars are bad for Reps. Cold Wars are good.
2008/08/15 [16:59] <@theagent> Biden = instant loss
2008/08/15 [16:59] <@theagent> Biden has to be the most polarizing Dem around
2008/08/15 [17:00] <+shareme> He picks CollinPowell?
2008/08/15 [17:00] <+petertsantilli> hey...should Bush be pushing the buttons on the Georgia crisis?
2008/08/15 [17:00] <@theagent> I'm waiting for the pic with Obama in a tank with a helmet on..
2008/08/15 [17:01] <+petertsantilli> theagent : LOL
2008/08/15 [17:01] <+donbonaddio> Georgia helps McCain
2008/08/15 [17:02] <+petertsantilli> we don;t know who it helps, until we see the Bush Admin <censored> this up...it aint over yet
2008/08/15 [17:02] <+donbonaddio> what about McCain choosing Liberman?
2008/08/15 [17:04] <@theagent> ok.. McCain picks Rice
2008/08/15 [17:04] <+petertsantilli> DRUDGE REPORTING: Kerry is in contention
2008/08/15 [17:04] <@theagent> woot! Kerry... that would be awesome
2008/08/15 [17:04] <+donbonaddio> Kerry? Rs will love that
2008/08/15 [17:04] <+shareme> MCain wa snot on Forrestal I thinkk DOle was?
2008/08/15 [17:04] <+alexbellinger1> Carey headed the War on Terror. Won two elections. Rice heads the new cold war on energy. Wins with Mccain ;)
2008/08/15 [17:04] <+alexbellinger1> cheney not carey
2008/08/15 [17:05] <+petertsantilli> INSIDERS LEAKING KERRY IS A CHOICE
2008/08/15 [17:06] <@theagent> Jimmy Carter?
2008/08/15 [17:06] <+donbonaddio> picking a loser again?
2008/08/15 [17:06] <+shareme> JC woul ddie in office
2008/08/15 [17:06] <@theagent> lots of foreign experience
2008/08/15 [17:06] <+petertsantilli> http://wbztv.com/politics/jonkeller/john.kerry.vice.2.796143.html
2008/08/15 [17:07] <+petertsantilli> Kerry?
2008/08/15 [17:08] <+shareme> Collin Powell?
2008/08/15 [17:08] <+mobilejones> Hi guys, I won't be back to NewsGang for a while. You can follow what I'm doing at http://gopunconventional.com
2008/08/15 [17:08] <+mobilejones> Too busy to participate until after that.
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+mobilejones> Adios.
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+petertsantilli> No
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+petertsantilli> Biden
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+shareme> Powell
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+petertsantilli> BIDEN!
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+shareme> Powell
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+petertsantilli> HOPE SO
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+petertsantilli> BYE EVERYBODY!
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+BruceLerner> follow you there Debbie.
2008/08/15 [17:09] <+alexbellinger1> bye thank you
2008/08/15 [17:11] <+WebPixie> thanks everybody
2008/08/15 [17:11] <+WebPixie> thanks jerry, tina, steve
2008/08/15 [17:12] <@TinaGillmor> thanks everyone
Session Close: Sat Aug 16 00:00:02 2008